[Article] The Four Conditionals in Japanese
Discussion: [Article] The Four Conditionals in Japanese
From the forum: Sam's Essays
This thread was started by: Glowing Face Man.
Discussion start time: 2009-11-14 16:26:43.
From the forum: Sam's Essays
This thread was started by: Glowing Face Man.
Discussion start time: 2009-11-14 16:26:43.
From: Glowing Face Man.
Subj: [Article] The Four Conditionals in Japanese
Date: 2009-11-14 16:26:43.
Subj: [Article] The Four Conditionals in Japanese
Date: 2009-11-14 16:26:43.
I like your way of explaining these, especially the first one.
Incidentally, the Japanese word order reminds me of an old computer geek joke, "Forth love if honk". (Forth was an old programming language...)
Many languages (perhaps most) have multiple kinds of conditionals. κοινη Greek, for instance, is traditionally regarded as having four.
Also, English has more ways of implying this than just the four you list, e.g., in written English you can imply a conditional relationship between clauses with a colon. You can also use the subjunctive mood to imply a conditional relationship, as in "Were I to comment on English conditionals, I would say that there are several different varieties of them."
Incidentally, the Japanese word order reminds me of an old computer geek joke, "Forth love if honk". (Forth was an old programming language...)
Many languages (perhaps most) have multiple kinds of conditionals. κοινη Greek, for instance, is traditionally regarded as having four.
Also, English has more ways of implying this than just the four you list, e.g., in written English you can imply a conditional relationship between clauses with a colon. You can also use the subjunctive mood to imply a conditional relationship, as in "Were I to comment on English conditionals, I would say that there are several different varieties of them."
と can be translated as "and" but only in the sense of joining two noun phrases together(ie. I like cats and dogs). It is not used in the english sense of the word and when joing two clauses together (ie. i went to the store and bought donughts). The te-form is used in that case, hence why the use of と in the conditional sense is considered so completely different. Its interesting to think though that they might be related in that same sense somehow.
as far as "when", don't forget 時
as far as "when", don't forget 時
Thanks, the article's both interesting and useful. I've been trying to remember my Japanese recently and I remember finding the conditional confusing.
I have a related question - it may be covered in Tae Kim's guide but unfortunately that site's blocked in mainland China for some reason, so I hope this is a reasonable place to ask it. In English it's pretty easy to have two different subjects in the if-then sentence, e.g. "If he drinks the medicine, I'll be happy". Is that true for any or all of these four conditionals as well? Could you say, for instance,
彼が薬を飲めなら、私は幸せです。
"are ga kusuri wo nomu nara, watashi wa shiawase desu"
or is it more complicated?
Apologies if the rest of the sentence grammar is poor - it's been a long time!
I have a related question - it may be covered in Tae Kim's guide but unfortunately that site's blocked in mainland China for some reason, so I hope this is a reasonable place to ask it. In English it's pretty easy to have two different subjects in the if-then sentence, e.g. "If he drinks the medicine, I'll be happy". Is that true for any or all of these four conditionals as well? Could you say, for instance,
彼が薬を飲めなら、私は幸せです。
"are ga kusuri wo nomu nara, watashi wa shiawase desu"
or is it more complicated?
Apologies if the rest of the sentence grammar is poor - it's been a long time!
I asked my girlfriend about this and her answer is extremely confusing...
With the specific example "If he drinks medicine, I'll be happy", it's better to use the verb compound "nondekureru" because it's like you want him to drink the medicine as a favor to you.
The things in parentheses are omittable. "Kureru" is never used about oneself, so it's implied that the subject of drinking is the other party and the subject of getting happy is you.
"(moshi) (kare ga) kusuri o nondekuretara (watashi wa) ureshii"
"(moshi) (kare ga) kusuri o nondekurereba (watashi wa) ureshii"
"(moshi) (kare ga) kusuri o nondekureru nara (watashi wa) ureshii"
("to" doesn't work because your getting happy isn't like a physical reaction)
It seems like this is a very difficult subject... hard to get a straight answer out of her =P Without the -kureru construction, "kusuri o nondara ureshii" is confusing without more context.
With the specific example "If he drinks medicine, I'll be happy", it's better to use the verb compound "nondekureru" because it's like you want him to drink the medicine as a favor to you.
The things in parentheses are omittable. "Kureru" is never used about oneself, so it's implied that the subject of drinking is the other party and the subject of getting happy is you.
"(moshi) (kare ga) kusuri o nondekuretara (watashi wa) ureshii"
"(moshi) (kare ga) kusuri o nondekurereba (watashi wa) ureshii"
"(moshi) (kare ga) kusuri o nondekureru nara (watashi wa) ureshii"
("to" doesn't work because your getting happy isn't like a physical reaction)
It seems like this is a very difficult subject... hard to get a straight answer out of her =P Without the -kureru construction, "kusuri o nondara ureshii" is confusing without more context.